Would Abiola Have Been a Good President?

[Mikky jaga]

Originally Posted by Eja

Mikky Jaga, Abiola made money from making what?

Must you make something before you make money? You can make money selling things; you can make money doing things and you can also make money by helping others manage their money etc.

And, what has happened to those much vaunted businesses of his today? Have they grown in scale and production? You see, I also ask this because, I am one of those who think that the greatest measure of a leader is to be found in not just what he does while he/she holds the big stick but, in the solidity, durability, and, adaptability that are built into the structures left behind.

Well Abiola died without having the opportunity to put his house or his business in order. He died after a long incarceration. He can therefore not be responsible for what happened to his businesses after him.

So, even if Abiola had being a great President who made money for Nigeria the same way he made for his own businesses, can we say for certain in what direction his successors have being compelled/able to take Nigeria in as a result of the structures he would have left behind?

So, a good president is judged by what his successors do with his legacy and not by what he achieved while in office? Going by that yardstick alone, there have been very few good presidents all over the world.

Eja, e be like say you get something for mind against this Abiola man. The way you dey take your argument, he get as e be.

[Eja]

What i do know and some people have made mention about it, is that the June 12 was not essentially about Abiola alone, but the collective desire of a country to experience and determine their own democratic future.

Omaks, the above I agree with totally. That is why I reject all attempts to re-invent this particular dead man as an icon of the event. Truth is, he turned out to be no more than a temporary figurehead because, when it really mattered, he failed to play his part.

He could have placed his trust in the Nigerian people and led the fight-back on the front-lines from day one, instead, he ran to seek the assistance of the same people who are eating hearty from Nigeria's dysfunctionality.

I am one who was deeply traumatised/disillusioned (like several other people who have spoken on it) by the sight of Abiola in a 5 Star hotel in the west occupying a whole three-seat settee with his outspread agbada and telling the 'powers' why they should give him the presidency of Nigeria.

All that being said, he was only human as we all are. Who knows, in his shoes, I might have done the same. Now, if I had suffered the same fate as he eventually did and ended up where he now is, I would be looking at the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. And, I would be saying "No, I am not worthy of being what they are trying to turn me into."

And you know what? Deep down, we are aware of this. That is why we let the thing happen in the first place and, it is why no one is really breaking their back to get the man turned into a "father of Nigeria". Disciples of Awo, Zik or Sardauna who were not even born when either of these men bestrode the arena still quote their words and describe themselves by labels that tell of whose spirit they walk after. Who and where are the 'Abiolaists'? What is their creed?

[Mikky jaga]

Originally Posted by Albany

Mikky,

so any president that performs better than OBJ and Yar'Adua is qualified to be called a good president ? Have we sunk that low ?

No, we never sunk low, we just dey start. We complained that Tafawa Balewa was bad, after him came Shagari that was worse, then this Yaradonothing. In between were sprinkling of odious men like IBB, Abacha and OBJ. We just dey start to sink. When we have sunk, you will not need Mikky to alert you.

Again, you want us to believe that since Abiola was successful in business, he would automatically have been a good president. Hello ? In effect, we should all vote for Dangote in 2011, since he is the most successful Nigerian businessman, ni ? Okay, now i understand why Yar'Adua's tenure has been a disaster....because he was a lecturer and not a successful businessman.

Abiola was successful in business as well as in politics. It was a no mean feat to emerge as SDP candidate and winning votes even at the backyard of his opponent. Dangote never showed interest in politics so, he is irrelevant as far as politics is concerned. Yaradua has never successfully managed anything in his life. His performance as Katsina State governor was woeful. He achieved nothing in his eight years as occupant of that State House. In places where previous performances count, Yaradua would never have been considered in the first instance.

You equally seem to forget that though Abiola was swimming in money, he had a dysfunctional family. Do you believe that a man who couldn't manage his immediate family will be able to manage a nation ?

I believe someone has answered you on this.

My take is that there is no way of knowing if Abiola would have been a good president, since he was never sworn in. Period.

Your take is equally faulty. If a man possesses relevant attributes that others did not have, he is more likely to be successful where others have failed. Abiola has shown he could manage a mega business successfully an attribute that the others do not have.

[Eja]

Originally Posted by Mikky jaga

Eja, e be like say you get something for mind against this Abiola man. The way you dey take your argument, he get as e be.

I no get nating against de guy O. Na de symbol wey dem wan turn am into na im me ah dey against.

A wise person once said that death freezes time. It is like a snapshot and, whatever event is in that picture, becomes what the one during whose very eventful life it was taken becomes remembered for/as.

A moderately tall man whose one surviving picture was taken while he stood to a freakishly taller man will be remembered as being a short man - or vice-versa.

There was a lot more to Abiola's character (and motives) than what is slowly trying to become his eternal image. We should not allow the loss of any facet as a result of revisionism. The most important thing about the guy as far as I am concerned is that he was an insider and therefore cut from the same cloth as the ones we are complaining about today. Wasn't Umaru Yar Adua once a 'disciple' of Aminu Kano?

Brother, politicians will play whatever part they need to play to get into office. Therefore, we can never predict what they are going to be like by what happened on the campaign trial. What we can base judgment on is the type of people that they surround themselves with - the circles that they move in. Actions over deeds. And, while there are many activities that would have us rightly describe say Abiola as having been a generous man, there are too few that would justify these projections of him being the type of leader who could have led Nigeria out of its present bondage.

Until his second (and fatal) falling out with the 'powers'-that-be in Nigeria over them allowing him to ascend to the 'highest' office, there is nothing Abiola did to show that he was a man who would rock the boat. Talk less of being the sort of leader who would be prepared to face up to the parasites (foreign and indigenous) who have been draining the so-called nation's life-blood.

You also said

Must you make something before you make money? You can make money selling things; you can make money doing things and you can also make money by helping others manage their money etc.

Well, no. You need not make things to make money. You are right there. But, note that the proper purpose of a well-managed economic environment is not just about the production of ones who can "make money": Money in itself is worthless if there is nothing to buy with it. Therefore, the real power in economics lies with those who (i) manufacture the things and, (ii) control the mechanisms that give money a purpose. [with (i) and (ii) being inseparable parts of the one thing]

Meanwhile, the most we can describe our Nigerian 'big-men' as having is a tiny bit of (ii)...therefore, their 'power' is limited....though, like the saying goes, "in the country of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.."

You also said :

So, a good president is judged by what his successors do with his legacy and not by what he achieved while in office? Going by that yardstick alone, there have been very few good presidents all over the world.

Yes. And that is why, in spite of all the resources, creativity, and good-will that the vast majority of humans possess, the world as a whole keeps lurching from one crisis to another.

Now, when you hear of great leaders from the so-called developed world, you are hearing about ones who were the most successful at exporting the miseries out of their own countries into foreign lands and, importing the resources needed for a good life out of those lands into theirs at a very reasonable () cost.

When will our Nigeria get such a leader? Look, Malawi is there for the taking (gahdemmit!!). Even ordinary Madonna is slapping them about and taking their children whenever she sees fit. Meeen! There are so many countries in our near abroad who are ripe for the picking but, instead of our Nigerian leaders organising matters so that we can go on a sustained rampage, they are busy buying mansions in Dubai, doing tummy-tucks and, dying on top of Arabian ashewo.....

The world is a jungle but, instead of mighty hunters, we are being led by vicious (yet cowardly) scavengers and bottom-feeders. O mase O....

[Albany]

Originally Posted by omaks

Albany, you goofed there, where you said Abiola's family was dysfunctional or that he couldn't manage his family.

Let it be known to you that the man succeeded in his complex polygamous marital life, where many fell short in their monogamous ones. Abiola loved women and he never hid it from anyone, his wives and children inclusive. Not one of his wives or children will claim that Abiola was irresponsible to his family duties. At least he was open about his preference for polygamy and lived his life accordingly. There are many of our political/community leaders who by the day are Monogamous , but by night BROWSE through Brotels, and Tertiary Educational campuses in search for young FILLIES. That to me is a sign of DISHONESTY.

Omaks,

the issue is not whether Abiola loved women or not. We all do, well, unless you are a homosexual. I can understand the way you feel, since you had a close relationship with the family but it doesn't detract from the fact that Abiola was a randy fellow, who had no self control as far as beautiful women are concerned. If he had stuck to his 4 (i believe) wives and had, say, 200 children, i would have had not qualms with that but he just had insatiable appetite for sex. Read the quote below from Simbili @ #3 and tell me if that is not the height of irresponsibility.

He had a very 'busy' life. Had 113 children, 25 children failed DNA tests, he disinherited 15 children, and out rightly disowned 2 children.

I just hope you have no plans of walking in his footsteps

[Albany]

Originally Posted by Mikky jaga

Your take is equally faulty. If a man possesses relevant attributes that others did not have, he is more likely to be successful where others have failed. Abiola has shown he could manage a mega business successfully an attribute that the others do not have.

Mikky,

it appears as if you post your comments impulsively, no offense ! Do you still remember what the title of the thread is ? Here: Would Abiola Have Been a Good President?. You replied @ post #13: ''definitely yes'' and supported it with your facts about how successful he was as a businessman. You went a step further and opined that.....

The problem with Nigeria is we tend to put people who never knew how to make money in power.

I faulted your logic, because one needs much more than a business acumen to succeed as a leader. Dick Cheney was successful as a businessman but certainly not as a leader/politician. So, it is wrong to ascribe success in leadership to individuals who happen to excel in business. Now, hear yourself again...

Abiola was successful in business as well as in politics. It was a no mean feat to emerge as SDP candidate and winning votes even at the backyard of his opponent.

You seem to forget that what it takes to win elections is a successful political machinery and in the case of Nigeria, you can add harassment, bribery, intimidation, rigging and thuggery. The issue remains that you can win 98% of the vote counts and still turn out as a poor leader. So, you can go round in circles as much as you want but your points remain factually wrong.

Have a wonderful weekend.

[maxsiollun]

Abiola was no firebrand political reformer and he was unlikely to rock the boat or risk confrontation. In many ways, he was part of Nigeria's corrupt elite. A government led by him would have continued with business and corrupt dealings as usual. His emergence was predicated on his membership of the corrupt elite.

In the end, the same military Leviathan which Abiola sponsored ended up devouring him.

[Ewuro]

Originally Posted by Mikky jaga

Your take is equally faulty. If a man possesses relevant attributes that others did not have, he is more likely to be successful where others have failed. Abiola has shown he could manage a mega business successfully an attribute that the others do not have.

Yes, Abiola had attributes, but they are not relevant to building a progressive nation. He was a master debuachery, treachery, flipancy, and corruption in every sense of the word. Abiola was morally bankrupt and tried to serve lucifer and God at the same time.

Where is the mega business? ITT was not his. It belonged to the Americans. It is all over the world and still doing business. Abiola was an employee who used his very corrupt instincts to makle money for ITT and himself. People are just not talking about an 80 million contract being turned to 800 million within a couple of years in the 70s. It was real. Of course he had the very greedy Murtala Muhammed as an accomplice.

Those were the funds that were chanelled to forming Concord newspapers, bakery, and a few other companies that you call mega business. Those companies never thrived because they were never really managed. Of course they survived because Abiola continued to pump in money from mega-corrupt engagement with despos anmd military boys all over Africa. Even Abiola Football club collapsed in his life time.
Abiola would not be a better president than Obasanjo. He would not even last six months! At least IBB, 'his friend' said so.

Did I support the annulment? NO. He won. There would be no difference between him and IBB, if he was allowed to realise his manadate. The country was fed up with IBB anyway.

Abiola's profile reveals a personality that would sell his country just as he betrayed even friends and siblings by sleeping with their wives.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by lateesha

Going by the way he handled women,NO

Ha, the most broad-minded, all-encompasing, intellectual comment here yet.

Congratulations!

Auspicious.

[Mikky jaga]

I think some people here are confusing Abiola of NPN days with Abiola of SDP. One thing that is constant in life is change and when I see positive change in any individual, whatever he may have been in the past just fades into insignificance.

Abiola of NPN days would definitely qualify for whatever description of him ewuro gave here, but he left that camp, decided to pitch camp with the progressives and that to me is a major step forward.

Many people that changed the face of the world were once part of the system they later changed. So it would have been with Abiola. If he had still been part of the system like OBJ, his elections would not have been so brazenly annulled. He was considered a threat to the establishment, hence the scheemings that he must not be there by all means, including murder.

Originally Posted by Albany

Omaks,

the issue is not whether Abiola loved women or not. We all do, well, unless you are a homosexual. I can understand the way you feel, since you had a close relationship with the family but it doesn't detract from the fact that Abiola was a randy fellow, who had no self control as far as beautiful women are concerned. If he had stuck to his 4 (i believe) wives and had, say, 200 children, i would have had not qualms with that but he just had insatiable appetite for sex. Read the quote below from Simbili @ #3 and tell me if that is not the height of irresponsibility.



I just hope you have no plans of walking in his footsteps

The height of irresponsibility. If you cannot run a tidy home, how can you run an untidy country? Did Bill Clinton not love women, infants and children? He did not make it a full time job, but Abiola did.

Thank you jare! I was not going to discuss more than that, but I see others have done the good job of analyzing Abiola's personal and professional life. In any civilized world of true democracy, this man would not even make the list of candidates, not to mention the primaries for very obvious reasons and brother Ewuro has aptly captured that below:

Quote of the thread:

Originally Posted by Ewuro

Yes, Abiola had attributes, but they are not relevant to building a progressive nation. He was a master debauchery, treachery, flippancy, and corruption in every sense of the word.

Abiola was morally bankrupt and tried to serve lucifer and God at the same time.

Where is the mega business? ITT was not his. It belonged to the Americans. It is all over the world and still doing business. Abiola was an employee who used his very corrupt instincts to male money for ITT and himself. People are just not talking about an 80 million contract being turned to 800 million within a couple of years in the 70s. It was real. Of course he had the very greedy Murtala Muhammed as an accomplice.

Those were the funds that were chanelled to forming Concord newspapers, bakery, and a few other companies that you call mega business. Those companies never thrived because they were never really managed. Of course they survived because Abiola continued to pump in money from mega-corrupt engagement with despos anmd military boys all over Africa. Even Abiola Football club collapsed in his life time.
Abiola would not be a better president than Obasanjo. He would not even last six months! At least IBB, 'his friend' said so.

Did I support the annulment? NO. He won. There would be no difference between him and IBB, if he was allowed to realise his manadate. The country was fed up with IBB anyway.

Abiola's profile reveals a personality that would sell his country just as he betrayed even friends and siblings by sleeping with their wives.

Truth be told. . . not to speak ill of the dead.

Sopono oooooooooooh!(Dahomey god of small pox)

*****BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAM*****


What we should really be celebrating is the fact that the lethal combination of:

"AIDS/HERPES/HEPATITIS/TB/SYPHILIS did not kill him first.

I will keep celebrating his life on those accounts.

God really loved him. See George Bush Sr. jumping out of airplanes with 'ROBIN' for his 85th birthday, while planning to do the same for his 90th birthday? Who thinks he does not love women? But there are more diplomatic and less messy ways of doing things. Ask John Edwards.

Why would any "normal" man or "woman" think sleeping around would be a hobby, or a full time job? It only shows one thing. The basest of moralities and constitutes the weakest of all character flaws. Not an attribute any successful president or leader with the required modicum of discipline should display for the world to see.

[Auspicious]

Tuh..!

People continue to miss the point.

The debate is NOT about if Abiola would have been a good President.

It is, rather, about the need for a people's sacred mandate to be respected.

It is about the fact that a Virgin ("Watershed") Election was virtually raped.

That is why June 12 and Moshood Abiola remains live-wire issues of discourse to date.

It is NOT about the now belated Abiola as an individual, nor his possible ablities nor the lack thereof;

It is about the FACT that we blew the historic opportunity that June 12, 1994 availed us, and have not been able to make it up snce then.

Hence why we'd probably do better asking thus: how can we have another of such election successfully?

Auspicious.

[chiagozie]

for wia? wahala for full ground and the battle for first ladyship would have made Iraq look like small pikin ten ten.

:d :d :d :d :d

Even President "Zuma" the "rapist" would have done better as he has currently demonstrated in South Africa.

[Lalakokofefe]

The real answer is, we will never know.

[Eja]

Originally Posted by Auspicious

Tuh..!

People continue to miss the point.

The debate is NOT about if Abiola would have been a good President.

It is, rather, about the need for a people's sacred mandate to be respected.

It is about the fact that a Virgin ("Watershed") Election was virtually raped.

That is why June 12 and Moshood Abiola remains live-wire issues of discourse to date.

It is NOT about the now belated Abiola as an individual, nor his possible ablities nor the lack thereof;

It is about the FACT that we blew the historic opportunity that June 12, 1994 availed us, and have not been able to make it up snce then.

Hence why we'd probably do better asking thus: how can we have another of such election successfully?

Auspicious.

Hmmm, yes, all the above: yes.

Also, by focusing so much on Abiola, we allow June 12th to be turned from a triumph of Nigerians into a date that marks one man's thwarted ambitions.

We also allow the subsequent myth that describes Obasanjo as the consolation prize given to the Yoruba to stand. Meanwhile, the truth is, the Yoruba had emphatically said that they did not want this consolation prize. Furthermore, progressive minded ones, in league with other Nigerians of a similar hue, had refused to keep silent before the narrative that presented Obasanjo as some sort of atonement for the aborted new politics. They had refused and it had been forced down their throat.

And now, when we hear people talk about June 12, they mention Abiola and, they later tell us about how enthroning Obasanjo had been a suitable apology.

June 12 is one thing and MKO Abiola's political adventures are another. They intersected yes. His adventures intersected at a certain point with the expression of the Nigerian people's uncensored will. It could have being anybody else. And, in a perfect world, it would have been somebody else.

[WaleAkin]

Originally Posted by Lalakokofefe

The real answer is, we will never know.

I was really waiting for this answer and then it came. Thanks Lala. It's not all these lamentation of Jeremiah that we have read on this thread but about the simple yet hidden fact that MKO despite having a stained past was willing and ready to lead Nigeria and help alleviate the masses suffering.

We never believed in Gov Fashola until we began to see his goodworks despite being a product of political godfatherism. Fashola proved us wrong and in less than 2 years cleaned up Lagos. Now, what gives the impression that MKO wouldn't have done the same?

SDP moved like a mighty rushing wind and I still remember it's mother of all conventions in the pictureque city of Jos where he won the mandate and just as Auspicious posited, it's not about MKO but about our political consciousness that was truncated.

I therefore write that we lost the best president via June 12 cancellation.

[Mikky jaga]

To try and separate Abiola from June 12 is like tryin to separate a badly joined siames twins. You cannot remove one without killing the other.

If Abiola had accepted to be "settled" Nigerian style rather than hold on to his mandate till the end, June 12 would have been forgotten by now. I am right to say that Abiola would have performed better. Those that annuled the elections never allowed me to be proved wrong.

[EbonyLomo]

Consider the fact that we have never had a good leader in the past, and you will have an idea what could have happened. On the other hand, consider the fact that he was elected overwhelmingly by Nigerians (A First), then you could also correctly assume that his time as President could have been different. All that we do know now is that some people denied us the opportunity to find out first hand what type of president MKO would have been.

As it is now, we should have moved on from what could have been to 'what IS'. Unfortunately 'What IS' is indeed an eyesore, which makes it absolutely painful and difficult for many of us to break away from 'What Could Have Been'.

[valteena]

Originally Posted by Mikky jaga

To try and separate Abiola from June 12 is like tryin to separate a badly joined siames twins. You cannot remove one without killing the other.
If Abiola had accepted to be "settled" Nigerian style rather than hold on to his mandate till the end, June 12 would have been forgotten by now. I am right to say that Abiola would have performed better. Those that annuled the elections never allowed me to be proved wrong.

Absolutely correct Mikky Jaga, you can not seperate Abiola from June 12. He won the election and no one else but him could have and have won such wide spread victory in an election. His obvious shortcomings not withstanding,I do not think it is not enough for anyone to conclude that he wouldn't have been a good President.
And like some have said already we do not know and would never know now Period. Sad