African Immigrants Clash With Black Americans

[molue]

Excellent write-up Mr. Deepthought.....It is really deep, concise and thought-provoking, many thanks.

@Obugi...I agree that both the Africans and AAs are fighting over crumbs at the bottom of the economic bucket instead of working together to lift up their lot. I will be happy to read your suggestions on how to resolve this seemingly intractable issue

@Lateesha...it's sounds a bit rich for us to simply assume that if all Africans or indeed, West Africans live outside these dangerous neighbourhood or "hell", the relationship between them and AAs will be perfect. Am afraid, it's not that easy. I believe that, despite the disconnect between West Africans and AAs that together live in "hell", it will require alot of effort/education/dialogue/trust/history etc for things to smooth out. Asking the AAs who are still learning about themselves to understand or tolerate others is a bit rich, just look at the disconnect between AAs in their communities and West Africans in theirs...Believe, it happens here too with the AAs basketball players and a few of the Africans that try to look up to them as role model...wanting to become a good baller too...majority of them (Africans) end up looking up to the Caucasian players as better role models after a few sad encounters with AA ballers.

@ILN...it can't be just all economic or poverty level or because AAs are being disrespected in their neighbourhood. How come we don't hear of West Africans being attacked in Jewish neighbourhood for wearing their native attire?. The average African is not that insular..i would say.

@Rose...think about Deepthoughts' comments above

@Auspicious...The usual muckraking.

@FSU...staying away from Nigerians? haba, u go come back after u hear whinnnn....walahi

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by I Love Nigeria

Rose You must ignore Auspicious and his ilks ...

Auspicious does not speak for me or anyone, for that matter!

HA! Ah don die! Bwahahaha!

And who do you speak for, ILN? Who, OBJ?

Coming from you, that is preprostrously hilarious.

Ignore Auspicious and "his ilks"? You? Ignore someone?

You obviously don't even realize how ludicrous you come across..

Otherwise you wouldn't dare claim to be "ignoring" anybody around here.

Folks are literarily dying to ignore you - your patronizing ways is..disgusting!

Auspicious.

[Oluwato]

Originally Posted by DeepThought

@Rose,...

In spite of the emotions and trauma that this may have and may still cause you (which I cannot even pretend to fully understand), perhaps it will be possible for you to one day understand the trauma and pain these things cause and continue to cause many Africans too.

Indeed, the slave trade was a great tragedy... and it will always be... I dream of a time when Africans and African Americans will see each other for who they really are..brethren!

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by I Love Nigeria

FSU and some other Nigerians have these siege mentality and stereotypical generalizations about Nigerians...

Hypocrite You!

You just called Africans all manner of sweeping names here.

"Snotty", "Condescending", "Clueless" and, wait for it, "Undiscerning".

And then you come back to preach about others' "siege mentality" and "generalizations".

Err..what about yours? I repeat: you, ILN, have NO shame - NONE WHATSOEVER!

Otherwise you wouldn't go about pandering to issues from atop that goddamn hypocritical platform.

Auspicious.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by Oluwato

Indeed, the slave trade was a great tragedy... and it will always be... I dream of a time when Africans and African Americans will see each other for who they really are..brethren!

As long as people like the Paul Adujies (ILNs) and the Roses out there spend their lifetime exploiting and deepening the existing divides between these two 'cultures', (both of which have people who are guilty of the kind of ignorance that offends the other), the dream of unity between these two folks will remain elusive.

The news report that launched this thread hardly fingered any one side at the expense of another, but here we have ILN acting like a doggone carpetbagger, careening to the sentiments of one side by trashing the other, while our 'friend' Rose embeds her jaundiced-as-usual views with the usual typical bigot innuendos.

What a disgrace - what a shame.

Auspicious.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by DeepThought

@Rose,

It is unfortunate that a lot of Africans are willfully miseducated about the AA condition, but conversely, the ignorance a lot of AAs show about African matters and the slave trade, as evidenced in those quotes (which reflect the standard belief of AAs , not withstanding that it was written by a non AA) are quite unfortunate and perhaps a little willful too.

However, I tend to understand and overlook ignorance on the part of the AAs much more than I do ignorance on the African side, based upon the opportunities the African now has of riding himself of the ignorance in which he is immersed in, and also based on the trumatic experiences of the AA and the poor filters through which the African story has been and is still being passed on to the AAs.

When you say quote and believe unqualified statements such as "as Africans did by selling African Americans" you quote people who have a very a superficial understanding of this situation. But again, its not as if there aren't some truths therein , so its hard to totally blame you or the people you quote. The thing is, most times, we want to have an "either/or" situation, that is, either something is true or not. The problem is that sometimes, something is not totally true and also not totally untrue.

You will always read in your popular versions of history books about how Africans participated in the Slave "trade" (this was never a trade - how can kidnappings and abductions be trade?) but you probably won't find any mention of African rulers who were deposed and sent into exile for opposing the Slave trade or any mention of ordinary day to day Africans who were opposition to the Slave "trade". And of course, do you think a person whose family member was kidnapped and who him/herself lives under fear of abduction would NOT be opposed to such a "trade"?

Does that make sense to you? So why would majority of Africans ever be in support of any such "trade"?

Let me ask you a question: Are you aware that some African Americans actually had , owned and kept fellow Blacks as slaves? Do you know this?. Did you know that there were Black Slave owners in the United States?

Compare the percentage of Africans on the African continent who participated in the Slave trade to the percentage of African Americans who owned fellow Blacks as slaves and on that basis, would it be correct for me to make an unqualified statement that "Africans Americans were buying and selling African Americans?"

There are always dangers in understatements and overstatements. While as an African, I cannot absolve Africans of some culpability in the Slave "trade", it would be quite foolish of me to place all the blame for this on Africans (Just as I cannot do the same with the White race)

In spite of the emotions and trauma that this may have and may still cause you (which I cannot even pretend to fully understand), perhaps it will be possible for you to one day understand the trauma and pain these things cause and continue to cause many Africans too.

Now, is this not someone talking about the same issue without using it as an excuse to make irresponsible comments about others whose "sin", amongst others, happen to be that they are "recent immigrants"?

And by the way,yes, Rose is a BLACK RACIST. About time people started telling her the truth around here. And don't tell me, that because she hangs out with folks on NVS, it suddenly makes her friends of Africans.

Cuz saying so only reminds of the White Guy who claims that yeah, I let black people sit on my couch so I can't be racist. The girl is racist jare. A racist that is terribly obsessed with race issues. That's a fact.

Auspicious.

[Rose]

Originally Posted by Auspicious

As long as people like the Paul Adujies (ILNs) and the Roses out there spend their lifetime exploiting and deepening the existing divides between these two 'cultures', (both of which have people who are guilty of the kind of ignorance that offends the other), the dream of unity between these two folks will remain elusive.

The news report that launched this thread hardly fingered any one side at the expense of another, but here we have ILN acting like a doggone carpetbagger, careening to the sentiments of one side by trashing the other, while our 'friend' Rose embeds her jaundiced-as-usual views with the usual typical bigot innuendos.

What a disgrace - what a shame.

Auspicious.

You are willfully ignorant and extremely misguided thinking it's your place to go anywhere speaking of running rough shod over anyone's "hangups" all because of your own warped and faulty outlook on affairs here. You are an intra-racial bigot to your very core…just twitching to incite conflict for delight of your old trading partner. What a waste!

And just because you walk amongst Blacks doesn't mean you're a friend either...exactly like charlatan in the WH!

[dem]

Originally Posted by I Love Nigeria

There are lingering mutual suspicions between continental Africans and African Americans... and this is quickly exacerbated by tough economic times... it is tough, struggling in the bottom wrung of society... There are no winners in these sorts of clashes... we should not give the appearance of rooting for any sides in this clash.

http://www.nigeriavillagesquare.com/...rants-etc.html

Continental Africans, African Americans and other peoples of African descent are broadly speaking, completely disengaged. There is a seething, if unstated antagonism. There is this mutual suspicion of intents and motives. There are these misconceptions and misperception between and within all our peoples. So, they reinvent integration and acceleration into America individually, painfully and slowly.

In both private and public conversations and debates or interactions, you would come across utterances by some immigrants who sound disdainfully contemptuous of all African Americans. In recent internet example, of such encounters that I have had, some African immigrants came across as if they were scrambling to justify the humiliations and indignities Professor Gates received in the hands of certain police officers in Cambridge Massachusetts! And their fetid defense of the police behavior met with vehement rejection by some other African immigrants as well.

On the matter of showing some respect and being sensitive to the sons and daughters of the soil, think and imagine for instance, that you are in your country, where historically, you have battled your own government for your rights, battled banks, all manner of institutions, entities even nonentities! And now comes, these clueless or undiscerning recent immigrants with condescension and superiority complexes!

I can only imagine how African Americans must feel about their life in America, and I example a snippet, to wit, I am in Nigeria struggling, and here comes a snotty clueless immigrant to Nigeria. I do probably wish to wring his neck!

@ILN

I agree with the above, but you appear to have left out the other side of the coin:

Some African Americans (and some Afro-Caribbeans) love nothing more than to put down continental Africans. It is the "poor society syndrome" where there is contrived "at least, I'm better than another person" false piety.

Part of it, of course, is also because continental Africans don't have some of the historical hangups of AAs and ACs. So they tend to be a bit more proactive and embracing (the other side) in their outlook. They just get up and do it. That often doesn't go down well with their cousins.

Economics also has its inate resentment. People naturally resent others coming to their hub and taking over. A few years ago, the Koreans were the focus. Now it seems to be some enterprising continental Africans.

But what I really cannot stand is immigrants that chose to separate themselves from their host communities. Why bother leave your own home then?

[liloldlady]

Slavery has ended. Colonisation is over, Blacks got the right to vote. Jim Crow is over. The KKK is laughed at around the world. Lets not forget Affirmative Action. Whites, Asians, Indians, Hispanics, and everybody seems to have a black friend or two…maybe even one or two of their best friends are black.

And yet, black people are still hating on each other, just as much as they ever have.
In Nigeria its Igbo v Hausa....Heck those ones even went to war about their hate.
In Mozambique.....Dayum it was that Gucci Guerrilla...Savimbi, who ochestrated their own brand of hate, just to get him to afford some designer boots....when they topped him ...end of war.
In South Africa....same thing...remember Buthelezi
Liberia, Ivory coast, Sudan, Somalia, Kenya, Mauritania, Congo, Guinea....
Ok I don't have all day but y'all get my drift.

Maybe instead of looking for all manner of reasons, and throwing blame right left and centre..plus including the usual wankers, doing what they do best, ie jerking off like the adept joystick experts they are...we should ask ourselves....Why do we hate each other so?
Why are we Black folks so hateful toward other Black people.

That is what this comes down to....Black on Black hate, but this time, its being played out in the United states....

We can employ all manner of esoteric tools, in a bid to explain what precipitated the incident in question....It is what it is.
It's garden variety black on black hate...just like the one we have perfected in Africa peeps. Just like the ones our AA, Jamaican, Brazilian etc... Bros and Sis, seem hell bent on outdoing us, when it comes to that kind of singularity of purpose viz, to inflict as much death and destruction on each other, as possible.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by Rose

You are willfully ignorant and extremely misguided thinking it's your place to go anywhere speaking of running rough shod over anyone's "hangups" all because of your own warped and faulty outlook on affairs here. You are an intra-racial bigot to your very core…just twitching to incite conflict for delight of your old trading partner. What a waste!

And just because you walk amongst Blacks doesn't mean you're a friend either...exactly like charlatan in the WH!

LOL!

Good, now you're raving mad - just where you need to be.

Auspicious.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by dem

@ILN

I agree with the above, but you appear to have left out the other side of the coin..

It wasn't an innocent ommission on the part of ILN that caused him to leave out the other side. Rather, it is a typically habitual case of his pandering to a side he wants to 'feel amongst' - you know, the "I am a 'New Yorker' who has been here forever" mentality that causes him to speak-down and look down on his fellow Africans who are "recent immigrants" as inferior to his 'grandfathered immigrant' self.

Some of us don't treat such nonesense with kid-gloves, but we highlight it and burn it up as the absolute tosh that it is. People need to be shown that others can see through their habitual pandering to sensitive issues that causes deep recentment between peoples everywhere - that while others may condone or try to minister softly to them, others will outrightly reject and lambast them for their duplicity!

And of course one understands all that may do nothing to change them. But it wouldn't stop some of us from shooting down their kites everytime it is flown, wether such kite be flown by a fellow Continental African or an African-American for whom race-issues is a Raison Detre with which she uses to sow distrust and animosity between brothers and sisters, having been bred on a diet of hatred and distrust herself.

Auspicious.

[Wind]

Deepthought, yours was brilliant, you took it right out of my mouth.
Rose I hope u took notes. In the later days of the nazi the guards at the concentration camps were jews. Yes fellow jewish prisioners who sold out for a little better food ration and living conditions. should we accused the jews of responsibility for the holocaust?

I see folks complicating a simple situation. fact is in life like minded people hang together. truth is most of the time the only common denominator between continental africans and african americans is the color of their skin and the LWB(Living While Black) thingy.

I think we assume too much when we say we should be buddy buddies cos of our skin. This Cubans and Mexicans don't necessarily get along either nor the pueto ricans and dominicans, neither do the pakistanis and indians and half the time I can't tell the fu*kin difference between them.

[Rose]

Originally Posted by Auspicious

It wasn't an innocent ommission on the part of ILN that caused him to leave out the other side. Rather, it is a typically habitual case of his pandering to a side he wants to 'feel amongst' - you know, the "I am a 'New Yorker' who has been here forever" mentality that causes him to speak-down and look down on his fellow Africans who are "recent immigrants" as inferior to his 'grandfathered immigrant' self.

Some of us don't treat such nonesense with kid-gloves, but we highlight it and burn it up as the absolute tosh that it is. People need to be shown that others can see through their habitual pandering to sensitive issues that causes deep recentment between peoples everywhere - that while others may condone or try to minister softly to them, others will outrightly reject and lambast them for their duplicity!

Your middle name is Duplicity so don't be surprised to find yourself on the receiving end of the same treatment you're trying encourage against ILN.

[Rose]

Originally Posted by Wind

Deepthought, yours was brilliant, you took it right out of my mouth.
Rose I hope u took notes. In the later days of the nazi the guards at the concentration camps were jews. Yes fellow jewish prisioners who sold out for a little better food ration and living conditions. should we accused the jews of responsibility for the holocaust?

I see folks complicating a simple situation. fact is in life like minded people hang together. truth is most of the time the only common denominator between continental africans and african americans is the color of their skin and the LWB(Living While Black) thingy.

I think we assume too much when we say we should be buddy buddies cos of our skin. This Cubans and Mexicans don't necessarily get along either nor the pueto ricans and dominicans, neither do the pakistanis and indians and half the time I can't tell the fu*kin difference between them.

Did the Jews create a flourishing "industry" of that practice spanning multiple centuries? Do the Jews travel to other countries hellbent on inciting instant conflict with fellow Jews by running rough shod on their "hangups" too?

[Obugi]

liloldlady,

And yet, black people are still hating on each other, just as much as they ever have.
In Nigeria its Igbo v Hausa....Heck those ones even went to war about their hate.
In Mozambique.....Dayum it was that Gucci Guerrilla...Savimbi, who ochestrated their own brand of hate, just to get him to afford some designer boots....when they topped him ...end of war.
In South Africa....same thing...remember Buthelezi
Liberia, Ivory coast, Sudan, Somalia, Kenya, Mauritania, Congo, Guinea....
Ok I don't have all day but y'all get my drift.

You forgot to add Black men and women hating each other to the extent that 75% of Negro children in America are born in single parent households. Its well documented that a high proportion of educated Black women would rather be single than accept marriage to Black men. The trend is that Black families (where they form at all) tend to disintegrate at a higher rate in societies where Blacks are more exposed to Caucasians, so you find that African immigrants are trending towards the same rate of bastardization.

Why do we hate each other so?
Why are we Black folks so hateful toward other Black people.

Because we instinctively compare Negroes to other races and react to the evidence we see. There isn't much mystery to it and I don't think there's much that can be done.

One solution is to encourage intermarriage with other races. In Negro societies with some measure of autonomy, arrangements can be put in place where Caucasians, Asians or other superior races can come in and live among us under mutually agreed conditions, as has happened in South Africa since the end of apartheid. We have to end this thing where African countries are the global equivalents of "bad inner city neighborhoods" in America.

In any case, I think these solutions are where we're headed eventually, my hope is that we'd put a more deliberate process in place instead of the current messy and painful evolution.

It takes courage to look at things as they are. It is very liberating. No need banging your head against the wall trying to change what you can't change. Negroes on the whole are have evolved a very individualistic response to their contact with foreigners; this response is characteristic of a race with very few intelligent people.

!Get Yours!
Obugi.

[lateesha]

Originally Posted by Rose

It's clear what is but he needs to know there's nothing acceptable in exporting his brand of ethnicism even if he does regards it his birthright. I can't imagine relocating to another country and going to war against the natives as a means of currying favor with a particular segment of the population. Seems there would be a better way of ingratiating oneself IMO.

Is this directed to auspy or to African immigrants in general.
Who is at war with you ?
That is what I'm trying to understand here.
Is there any Nigerian here whose goal was to can and seal up the African Americans when he/she set foot in America.
Please get off this victim mentality.

If you ask many of us to be sincere,we were envious of you folks.
We loved you and loved seeing our fellow black people succeeding in America.
We would have talks in our homes and wonder if any AA we saw on TV could actually be a relative.
I remember watching Mohammed Ali as a little girl and loving him.
We were saddened by the stories of the slave trade and what people had to endure.

fast forward lateesha in America
Some of the nastiest treatments and worst attitudes my husband and I ever got in this country was by AA
Some had even gone behind to white directors to tell blatant lies because they couldn't see how this African would be over them and that's not enough for me to generalize about AAs
They are the ones that'll make fun of my accent, criticize my hair.
many of them feel we are here to "take over" when all I'm doing is looking to make a dollar or 2.

We are not your enemies and we've never been.
The story that started this thread is yet to be addressed.
Why are AA youth targetting and maiming African immigrants and beating up their kids wearing their traditional attire.
Is is not the same mindset of "what are these Africans doing here" ?
Show me one single story where an African attacked an AA because he was AA.
The offence is always from your own end from name calling to physical abuse and all you've done is give it some sort of "legitimate" reasons why AA should be angry at Africans.
I don't get it

[lateesha]

We saw the thread and video clip about Mr Usman who was cheating on his AA wife.
What were her insults towards him?
His Africanness.
Most of the names he was called had nothing to do with his cheating but everything to do with his being a Nigerian, an African etc.
Like saying how dare this MF African monkey cheat on me.
watch the clip again if you doubt me

That spoke volumes to me how you AA's view Africans.

[Miliki Way]

Originally Posted by lateesha

The offence is always from your own end from name calling to physical abuse and all you've done is give it some sort of "legitimate" reasons why AA should be angry at Africans.
I don't get it

Always??

Dat na babanla iro (capital lie)!

Who invented the derogatory word a-k-a-t-a? Is it not Nigerians? Have you not seeing Nigerians using that word liberally? Even here on NVS nko?

Abegiiii...

[Rose]

Originally Posted by Miliki Way

Always??

Dat na babanla iro (capital lie)!

Who invented the derogatory word a-k-a-t-a? Is it not Nigerians? Have you not seeing Nigerians using that word liberally? Even here on NVS nko?

Abegiiii...

And she has used it on a number of occasions on these boards...so I can imagine how she unloads in private. Go figure.

[lateesha]

Originally Posted by Miliki Way

Always??

Dat na babanla iro (capital lie)!

Who invented the derogatory word a-k-a-t-a? Is it not Nigerians? Have you not seeing Nigerians using that word liberally? Even here on NVS nko?

Abegiiii...

The same way we invented the derogatory word Oyibo and oyinbo.
are those derogatory too?
Oyinbo land for abroad
jand is another word
Nigerians also say one is going to a-ka-ta when they are talking about America.
It has no bearing to anything bad so please let's not make it what it's not.


when I used always there I was strictly referring to the attack on Africans by AA.Until one produces me a news article to the contrary, I stand by that.