Afrocentric (i.e. the Africa centred perspective

[Eja]

I would like to debate the subject of an Africa centred perspective.

It is my opinion that the most logical position from which a person of African ethnicity can view the larger world is one which is based firmly on the perspective that is currently described as Afrocentric.

I will seek to convince, in the course of this debate, that to be Afrocentric should overide all other ideologies/religions that have their power-centres outside the continent of Africa.

I institute this debate in the hope that in its course, we may obtain (for the record) on this site, the plain facts and reasoning behind which some have based their negative outlook towards the concept in the title. It is my intention to show the illogicality of such reasoning (especially when coming from ones who claim to be Africans).

[Shoko Loko Bangoshe]

Hello Eja,

I'd like to debate this with you.

Shall we agree to a six-submissions-or-less debate, as per the rules on the Crucible?

If anyone wishes to moderate, that's fine; but I think we understand each other enough not to get into the gutter and need a moderator's intervention.

[Eja]

Honour SLB,

Thank you for accepting. I rub my hands in anticipation. Six submissions or less it is. Expect my first submission within the next few hours.

Best Regards
Eja

[nero africanus]

yes

it has happened

no sleep today..................................

[Big-K]

Hey guys, I apply to moderate

[DeepThought]

Though I don't think a moderator is necessary to temper languages as I know the two prospective debaters to be decorous, I think you will need a moderator to summarize your arguments and I'm glad Big K has volunteered


Interestingly enough, I never used to consider myself Afrocentric. I grew up seeing things mainly from a very Eurocentric perspective.

All my life , I had been consciously and unconsciously instilled with the view that European way was better. Now I know better

Lets see how this debate play out!!!!!!

[Big-K]

OK, assuming you guys accept my moderatorship of this debate, here's how I prefer that we go;

1. EJA will make his first submission,
1a. Readers will be given a time period to clarify any points (clarification, not counter the arguments) and suggest any additional points if they want to align with his views
1b. Then EJA will be given the opportunity to finetune his submissions based on #2 above.

2. /2a/2b Then, SLB will present his counter argument. Similarly to 1a and 1b, readers can suggest or buttress and SLB can finetune his argument.

When we have this scenario repeat itself 6 times, we will hopefully have a very rich 6-point debate.

[Auspicious]

Ha!

I wouldn't mind be a part of this.

Auspicious.

[DeepThought]

Ah, fearless Auspi is here.

Now there will be trouble for sure! Not to worry, when it gets too hot, we'll post something on Obama

[Auspicious]

Fearless ke?

I am a "Chicken" o..!

Auspicious.

[emj]

Hmmm.......interesting.....let's get it on...roll tape abegy

[wonderer]

This is an interesting subject

...waiting in anticipation

[Eja]

POSTULATE - In the context of this debate, used as "a hypothesis advanced as a premise in a train of reasoning."

1.00 :The first part of this presentation will be a list of postulates. Indulgence is required as I will be approaching the main subject indirectly.

1.01: Every sentient being has a perspective. A perspective, in the context of this reasoning, is described as the coordinates within a mind from which the nature of awareness is determined as its owner relates objectively and subjectively to phenomena that occur in its immediate environment (and in the larger world around it).

1.02: Not all sentient beings are aware of the true scale of the world outside of their immediate environment. For some, this limited awareness is due to the restrictions of physical being (e.g. most mammals cannot reside permanently under water) but, for others, this limited awareness is due to voluntary or, imposed ignorance.

1.03: Where the outside world has no noticeable effects on a being, then to be of limited awareness need not necessarily be detrimental. However, when the outside world is conspicuous by its relentless demands and noticeable effects, then to be fully aware of the nature of all external entities and of the grand intentions behind their interventions is a primary necessity. As is the way of thinking that guides the inception and implementation of ones tailored responses.

2.010: I assert that for all the various peoples of the Earth, the true religion that guides the aims of the societies they create is based around/on ethnicity.

2.011: I assert that the concept of religion was created for the reason of giving humanity a perspective from which sense can be made of the surrounding Universe and, that the reason this specialised form of awareness was required was so that long-term purpose could/can be determined.

2.012: I therefore identify as a religion anything that attempts to place the everyday existence of man within a framework of that which outspans human lifetimes and normal experience.

2.02: I assert that identity is the main component of religion. That we define the highest deity by what we assume to be the highest ideals that we can aspire to as a people and, that we identify the Earthly incarnation of this deity with ourselves (and our physical form).

2.030: I assert that all humans are hard-wired to be religious.

2.031: That even those of us who identify ourselves as atheists are simply adherents of a new label that has been appended to the mind-set/concept that was first described as "religious".

2.032: That all we have done, in our atheist incarnations, is remove the image of a Supreme Being from our conception of religion.

2.033: That in its place, we have put what we currently describe as "scientific facts"; the majority of which were/are derived from theories (i.e. ways of thought that are also largely dependant on 'faith' - "a belief in things not seen").

2.04: I also identify allegedly 'godless' ideologies like communism to be nothing more than offshoots of the religious instinct. In other words, I identify all ideology to be a form of religion.

2.05: Now, since even those who would claim to have no religion will hardly deny having an ideology, and if it is accepted that paragraphs [1.01 and the set of 2.01x] are two halves of a whole, then we can see how in all matters of relating to the universe at large, perspective and the awareness it breeds are everything.

3.010: To be Afrocentric means that a person is one who seeks to relate with the world at large on the basis of how this world at large impacts on him/her self as an African being.

3.011: I propose that the alternatives to the Afrocentric view can be divided into two species. These are, the ideal and the real.

3.012: The ideal view is the humanity-centred view and, when we are governed by this way of perceiving, we are compelled to act in ways that affirm our knowledge that all humans are the same and should be given the same opportunities in all realms of human existence/organisation.

3.013: It is difficult to see any reason why this view should not immediately prevail however, we need not be told that at this moment in human time, the ideal view prevails no where on Earth. What we have as a reality is the existence of perspectives that are basically fed by the impulse to establish, on as wide a global scale as possible, a dispensation that is most favourable to the members of whatever ethnicity one belongs to.

4.010: I assert that the human species can be divided into two. Those that have been subsumed within the instinctive agenda of other ethnicities and those who are actively engaged in subsuming others within the instinctive agenda of their ethnicity.

4.011: Africans are currently placed within the first category and, this is because, unlike those from the second category, Africans consistently fail to act collectively while in pursuit of the instinctive agenda of all living things (i.e. to survive and to thrive).

4.012: I propose that the primary reason things are like this is because unlike others, during this particular epoch of human history, Africans have not articulated an indigenous common purpose (bound up as religion/ideology) or a basic universal philosophy that selfishly places the creations of their own mind (past and present) at the centre of the Universe.

5.01: I come now to the reason I have persistently used the word "religion" as I sought to make my points. The human instincts that are nourished by the concept described as "religion" is a tool. Since I have equated religion with ideology and, since I now further place within the orbit of this equation the concept of principles, I can also say that the human instincts that are nourished by the concepts described as ideology (i.e. formalised ideals) or principles, are also tools.

5.02: I repeat, in a more succinct manner: Human instincts are tools.

5.03: The present is a child of the past and the parent of the future. All are inextricably linked. The Arabs derived an Arabocentric perspective and sold it as the basis of a religion to whoever was willing to buy. The Europeans, more cleverly, derived various Eurocentric perspectives and sold them as religion or ideology to all who would buy. Right now, as we are witness the conflict between these two tools of dominance, we can also see on the sidelines (for now) how other societies, notably the Hindu and the Chinese are guarding their borders with views that can best be described as Indocentric and Sinocentric. While we may not be certain that either society will become like the second category described in [4.010] above, we can be certain that they are now in little danger of falling within the first category.

5.04: I conclude by saying until we Africans subscribe to a way of thinking that selfishly places the creations of our own minds (past and present) at the centre of the Universe, then we as a collective stand no chance of departing from the ranks of ones who may best be described as floundering prey.

[Eja]

If SLB is willing, the proposals put forward by Big-K can be adopted in full.

[Shoko Loko Bangoshe]

Hello Eja,

Big K's proposals work for me. I will wait for a few hours for any requests for clarifications, etc. to come from the audience before I submit my response to your first post.

I'd also like to suggest that at the end of the debate, there should be a vote amongst the audience to see the margin by which I have defeated you erm, I mean who has won the debate.

Shoko

[bubbles]

this should be interesting.

i like what i've read so far.

[Auspicious]

I don't know what the rules here in the Crucible are like, but my views are this simple:

THE African cheats himself badly as an individual if he restricts himself to viewing things strictly from an African point of view - usually described in the term Afrocentric. This does NOT apply simply to the African, it also applies to the European, Asian, South Asian etc.

In an Era where the World is becoming a Global Village, where barriers of various hue are slowly giving away to usher in a new Era that affirms the belief that there is strenght in numbers or, that variety is the spice of life, one cannot afford to limit himself to seeing things through the narrow prism of ones heritage.

The White Supremacist takes his beliefs from the same doctrine that sees things strictly from this supremascist mindset. As far as he's concerned, every other view is inferior to his supreme view. And from there, his belief that every other gene type or culture or outlook is inferior to his is established and sealed.

Some will say, "Good for Him. At least he's proud of his heritage - much unlike the African who disparages his without second thoughts while embracing another man's culture". What these folks don't realize is that the dude who seals himself into such coccoon has willfully sealed himself in permanent ignorance of the outside world.

The relatively young man called Barack Obama, who is currently the front-runner of the Democratic Party in the American presidential race today has his greatest assets in the diversity he personifies. Unlike his fellow contestants or the leaders who preceeded him, he sees the world through a wide range of perspectives.

And that puts him in an attractive position in the eyes of many who yearn for the day when America will learn to approach and deal with the rest of the world without the usual gong-ho attitude of forcing her culture and civilization down the throat of other nations with the kind of reckless abandon that alienates America.

In the same manner, the African who chooses to see issues and the world strictly through his Lens of Afrocentrism is likely to alienate himself badly - especially at a time when she's already badly alienated by circumstance of history. It is in the African's interest to try not only to see things through his Afrocentrism, but also through others lens so he can survive in a competitive world.

I am Auspicious...and I love Jack Daniel and Coke.

[Big-K]

Auspicious,

Are you aligning your views with Eja's or seeking clarification? Right now, all responses should be seeking to build Eja's position. Once Eja's position is clear to all, SLB will then reply

[katampe]

I am reading Eja 's submission and I am having a migraine.

In the interest of fair play and to knock of the air of profound insight that he seeks to create with his so called postulations. I will condense his treatise to readable, clear and concise language, so everyone can fully understand the implication of his argument.

Also, so we won't be hoodwinked by this man. And my action should help expand the community of commentators, instead of the pretentious few , the discourse community of crucible loyalists like the Neros and the Deep Thoughts. I see you smelling this fake people already.

I dey come. una dey wait ?

[Eja]

Originally Posted by katampe

I am reading Eja 's submission and I am having a migraine. In the interest of fair play and to knock of the air of profound insight that he seeks to create with his so called postulations. I will be condensing his treatise to a readable and a clear, and precise language format, so that everyone can fully understand what he has put before us. And so we won't be hoodwinked by this man and it would enable us have an enlarged community instead of a pretentious discourse community of crucible loyalists like the Neros and the Deep thoughts. I see you smelling this fake people already.

I dey come. una dey wait ?

I laugh at this irredeemable Kegite (lef de ogogoro alone Oga! lef am alone!) and his attempt at an early derailment. I must be doing something right if I can cause the palmy-addled foe to crawl out of their circle of inebriation so early in the day.....

Senator Katampe, please do not presume to be "condensing" my "treatise".

I smell fraud.

State what you disagree with in full (i.e. within the context it is presented in) and then state the opinions on which your disagreement is based.

Do not tell me what I mean and then argue with your own condensed milk. Dat one na fake debate.